News Source: 1
Published: Feb 11, 2008 - 09:40 am
Story Found By: dannysullivan 1564 Days ago
Category: Sphinn Zone
33 Comments
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News Source: 1
Published: Feb 11, 2008 - 09:40 am
Story Found By: dannysullivan 1564 Days ago
Category: Sphinn Zone
33 Comments
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Comments
A story from Rae’s site got submitted twice today, and it was the first submit (that she did) which was allowed to live, while Dosh Dosh’s was killed. But Dosh’s had 9 sphinns to Rae’s 6. Should that with the most Sphinns win? Thoughts and comments, below. First, let me define a duplicate submission. To me, this is when the same exact URL gets into Sphinn twice. It shouldn’t happen, but it can primarily if two people start submitting at the same time. The system checks to see if a COMPLETED submission using that particular URL has gone through. If you submit before someone else has completed, it doesn’t catch that. Yes, we could probably find a way to lock out this from happening. But on the long list of things to do, it’s not at the top. In fact, I’m going to post a general Sphinn roadmap hopefully later today to give some priorities to stuff we think we need to get to first -- especially when this particular thing doesn’t come up that often. OK, in that situation, which Sphinn should die. I think we generally kill the following ones, letting the first one win. That’s what we did in this case. Problem? Well, Rae’s original submit had 6 sphinns. Dosh Dosh had 9. Should we have favored the one with the most Sphinns? I don’t know -- what do you all think? I tend to think whoever submitted first gets to have their Sphinn live. Why not just merge them. Hey, believe me, I’d love to do that. But I cannot tell you how rudimentary the Pligg software is compared to say forum software like VBulletin, where you could do this. We simply can’t merge right now. And we could look into a way to do that, but like I said, on the roadmap of issues, there just seem to be other things that stand out as a far more important. For the record, for those who find it interesting, here’s the voting breakdown when I looked: Voted only on the original submit (3 out of 6) FeydakinGabMattMcGee Voted only on Dosh Dosh’s second submit (6 out of 9)DoshDoshzparachaliamvictorTheMadHatSexySEOcharlieanzman Voted on both (3 out of 9 / 3 out of 6)martinbowlingSugarraeNickWilsdon Oh, and Rae’s story on Sphinn...http://sphinn.com/story/27774
I vote for exactly what you did - first submission wins, regardless of number of sphinns
To answer the question - the first one should be kept. I can’t see any other fair way of doing it. I’m surprised this isn’t seen as more of a problem though, it’s happened twice to me now. It is really annoying to make a submission, just to have it deleted. I’m also not sure the time window is as small as you suggest Danny. For example, on your SEL MS/Yahoo post, surely you submitted that to Sphinn before you posted it on Twitter?
First one wins, I would say.
First in...should win.
I always start pretty deep in the upcomming and work forward so it’s rare that I accidentally sphinn the more recent submission.. But, in this case, these submissions were 2 minutes apart and only had one post in between them.. I think that it might be fair to say that dosh’s was sphunn more often because There is a picture in the avatar vs the green sphinn icon (I tend to not read those)Dosh is a known sphinner and the social side of things kicks in and gets more votes.All that said, first in wins, especially if there is a way that you can move comments / sphinns from one post to the other..
any way you could merge them, add the votes and delete the duplicate votes...
First one should win in my opinion. But if you are thinking that number of votes should remain a factor, than you could leave it that both stay up.@dalka’s idea of merging the 2 could be interesting, but this might be something that people could take advantage of. Keep it simple - first in wins.
Sorry I know this is off-topic - but people please, if you have a standard green avatar, UPLOAD SOMETHING! It really is the easiest step you can make to getting more votes (we’ll get onto titles later...) I remember Tad (?) talking about sabotaging Digg submissions for someone by sticking the word ’SEO’ in the title. Sphinning articles with a green avatar is pretty similar.
First one to win.
Even though the search function here doesn’t work, clearly the first one to post should be the winner. That time should be the time the Submit button is clicked. If everyone knows the rules, there can be no hard feelings.
>>> A story from Rae’s site got submitted twice today, and it was the first submit (that she did) which was allowed to live, while Dosh Dosh’s was killed. But Dosh’s had 9 sphinns to Rae’s 6. Should that with the most Sphinns win?I do feel the need to correct something... I actually didn’t submit the first Sphinn... martinbowling did... doshdosh submitted the second, apparently within moments of each other.Secondly, I agree the one submitted first should win, but I also think Sphinns should be combined and not simply "lost" from the secondary post as I mentioned today in my Twitter...
I think it’d be nice to have a dupe that’s gained some traction simply be "locked" so to speak by not allowing anymore sphinns or comments and that a link to the original story is posted at the very end of the comments section. dalka’s whole merging votes thing would be kinda nice too.
And Danny, as you mentioned, it will still likely hit homepage, but the timing is now all off...The story is currently at 11, but missing six viotes, which would have put it on the "ten most sphunn" list on the sidebar by now (and actually, prob much sooner)... so it delays the time it goes "hot" - which also delays votes being cast in other social media realms if Sphinn is being used as the catalyst (i.e. the story only has 24 hours to go on Digg... and the delay in being Sphunn hot delays a very "digg heavy" user crowd from seeing the post and being able to cast votes). It also delays momentum in delicious bookmarking and stumbling... there is no guarantee any on any of these things, but the loss of six Sphinns and the trickle down effect definitely will have an impact. Additionally, when popular Sphinner’s like doshdosh Sphinn something, it puts it on a lot of people’s radars... so, his vote - or any power user’s - simply being lost and not transferred also has a detrimental effect.I’m not "complaining" - just pointing out how a loss of a "few votes" can have a very big effect on a post.
To me it’s the article that’s important, not who spunn it, so I’d like to see the sphinns merged. Barring that, yeah, the first in stands.
I think the first one sphinned. Honestly some people get more sphinn’s regardless just becaues of who they are.....
I would let the higher profile sphinner’s submission stand. It would be more beneficial for whoever published the article to have someone with a track record of hot sphinns to submit. You might as well reward the person who created the content by increasing the likelyhood that their submission will go hot. I, personally, come across sphinnable stories all the time but do not submit because I figure that someone else (who has a much better chance of helping the story go hot) will eventually sphinn it.Of course if DoshDosh and Tamar (or two new users, for that matter) submit the same story a few minutes apart, then just go with whoever was first.
Keep the first every time. The only fair way to do it.
I’m joining the crowd and suggesting the first one submitted stays. That is unless I’m the second submitted in which case the second one stays :-)
The phenomenon of stories from certain sphinners being more popular is really odd. People check who else has sphunn something before deciding to sphinn it themselves. They check the profile page of the person that submitted it. How about actually reading the stories and deciding for yourself if it’s interesting?Favoring the submission with the most sphinns will only perpetuate that practice. Eventually the group of people that actually submit will be pretty small, because otherwise why bother?First submission should win, no matter who they are.
First one in should get the credit - sphinns depend largely on who submitted, less so on the content (as this obviously shows).Another point is that we should be spending time looking at all submissions, and not just dismissing newer members’ contributions out of hand.Finally, Danny’s thread starter suggested the merging idea, and while Dosh’s story has been deleted, I posted it there even prior to this. So Danny and Dalka’s comments are both dupes :P lol. THen again, mine probably was too, as I’m sure someone thought of merging before me.On a related note, since mods can boost something to the frontpage manually, perhaps they might be given some similar power to reassign votes, or just add several votes to a story? It might get us around Pligg’s limited functionality?
First one gets the honor... It’s not about credit. It’s about the joy of scooping somthing GROOVY for this wonderfully insightful and vital community of teachers and students.
I’d combine the sphinns, so long as it’s not a blatant attempt at manipulation. Chances are, the same person whon’t sphinn the story twice, so they’re missing out.
it’s sad though isn’t it? that rae’s useful post only gets 12 sphinns while this little discussion gets 27?
I agree that the first one stays while the second one gets killed. That’s how most social news sites work. From the POV of an active social media user, it pays to be fast and should continue to be that way. Like Marty said, it’s fun to break news and share stories. Sometimes this isn’t the case though: http://sphinn.com/story/22532 (my submission)http://sphinn.com/story/22673 (graywolf’s submission) Both the same story. Both went hot. His submission was made a little later than me.Another point is that we should be spending time looking at all submissions, and not just dismissing newer members’ contributions out of hand....People check who else has sphunn something before deciding to sphinn it themselves. They check the profile page of the person that submitted it. How about actually reading the stories and deciding for yourself if it’s interesting?It’s the way social news sites work. Many people have already discussed about the issue of blind sphinning:http://sphinn.com/story/12292http://sphinn.com/story/18112Yes, story quality should be the no.1 factor involved in sphinning a story or not but sometimes an avatar and regular participation makes a big difference. It’s called ’social’ news after all.
First one second one killed - easy. Cant we have a notification "is this a duplicate"?
@HoboYou are meant to get that but sometimes as DoshDosh also noticed the Pligg function seems a little flakey. I had another case a week or so back where the difference was 8 hrs - trying to find the example as I abandoned the submission once I read the story in the upcoming list. Most times though, if you try and submit a URL that is already in the system, it will notify you and point you to vote on that story.
Add up the votes! Merge the posts. @Nick, yes it was me. It was more of a parody but people read it a as real how to and it became one of my most pupular posts ever surprisingly.
Dare I say 301 redirect? I don’t see any reason not to combine the sphinns, after you decide they are unique, of course.
I’d say that the first Sphinn should would win, but with the cavet that the two be merged into one (once we are able to do that which, as Danny said, doesn’t appear to be possible at the moment).
Danny - Just noticed this and re-sphunn. Good to see you this engaged. Sphinn could have Sphunn out of control, and maybe was beginning to a little?. My take would be to add to sphinners from ’the about to be’ deleted sphinn. The same piece IS the same piece? Regardless of who Sphunn it. Anyway, hope you’re having some Sfun doing this. It can’t be easy.
Danny’s original idea was to sphinn your own original content - now sphinn’s become a human-powered techmemewho cares who sphinns a news story first? Techmeme publishes the PR Wire or Business Wire press release and puts the blog commentary belowshare stories, OK - that’s why blue links were created posting first from an RSS feed? Barry does a great job rounding up blog posts by category every day in SearchCap; Kevin Newcomb does a great job rounding up blog posts in SearchDay. breaking news? I must have missed the sphinn that qualified as breaking newsthe problem is the low number of sphinns even the hottest posts get (with exception of challenges & all-time favorites)desphinning seems like a waste of time. Why bother? So a sphinn goes from 19 votes to 18.5?
Kevin, the original idea on Sphinn was that people should not have to be afraid to submit their own good stuff directly. Over at Digg, the idea of self-submitting is heavily frowned upon and sometimes seen (wrongly) as spam. Here, I didn’t think people had to think they needed to hide behind someone else to say "hey world, I wrote something cool." That’s still the case.Some people do care who submits first -- in particular, those who for whatever reason like to be the first to get a story out there. That’s especially so in a place like Sphinn or another social news site where it’s not supposed to be about every single thing gets submitted but that people finding the best signal from the noise. If you’re consistently a great "tuner" of information, then yeah, you’d like some kudos for having spotted something first and not having that taken away.Not sure what you mean on the low number of Sphinns hot posts get. You have to hit around 23 Sphinns to go hot. If I hit a general purpose place like Mixx, stories there are in the 20-30 range. For us to have the 23 level consistently generating about 20 different stories to the home page per day, that’s a ton of participation for a social news site focused on a niche.Desphinning is new, but as we’ve explained many times elsewhere, we see it as a way for the community to provide balance without the moderators having to jump in an make judgement calls. It’s also a way to help ensure people don’t just go for the spam button looking for some alternative to seeing a story go hot.